Dnano Bearings

[Tsal]

I'm not here to start a flame war, but to suggest an alternitave that in my mind is a better deal considering my 25 years experience in RC and tens of thousands of dollars later. Like I stated this is my opinion.

[Tsal]

Originally Posted by MrNanoTrax

isn't that the point of a 'sealed' anything? not having to clean it?

If this is what you believe then I'm ok with it.

[SiRay6]

wow lets not get too carried away guys :P

This is after all just RC cars...not even real racing lol.

But seriously, even real racing isn't about dumping every $ possible to be considered "hardcore racers"...

as far as i know, Subaru and Suzuki are out of WRC, Porsche and Audi are out of ALMS, Honda out of F1, and I believe i read a while back that Motorcycle racing isn't doing too well either (getting costly for these manufacturers)...

So racing isn't necessarily just about having deep pockets...as long as the cars are setup similarly, there can still be very competitive racing

I believe it would be just as fun to run box stock dnanos in a "stock" class...would you guys agree? Its about fun, lets not forget that

Thanks Tsal for doing the work for us and finding out the size of bearings we need I personally like doing the tests myself and find that part fun...I'll be ordering the bearings and comparing Kyosho, Boca economy, boca ceramic

-Ray

[MrNanoTrax]

Originally Posted by SiRay6

wow lets not get too carried away guys :P

But seriously, even real racing isn't about dumping every $ possible to be considered "hardcore racers"...

-Ray

forums are all about discussion and debate so to me, this is normal banter between guys with differing opinions, interested in the same hobby. i'm cool

by 'hardcore racers' i assumed this meant people who race often - which i do. i don't think one needs deep pockets at all, i just think what's expensive to one person may not be to another.

i think most 'RCers' like to tinker and try different things and again, if you feel like some of the items that have proven 'best' by 'hardcore racers' isn't for you, just don't get them BUT... because they are 'expensive' doesn't make them 'bad' or 'not worth it'. it IS all about fun... post your results on your findings, Ray... we're all interested and appreciate your sharing and that includes TSal for researching and offering an alternative.

[arch2b]

there are countless threads on the warrant of cheap or expensive ball bearings. this is well documented throughout all scales of rc. if you want the best, you pay for it.

a quick search on mini-zracer gives you this.

and yes, even at this scale the difference in quality bearings is real.

[SiRay6]

I'm trying to order the bearings today but i'm so confused.

I know the front econo 10 pack is 4 x 1.2 x 1.5

the rear econo is 6 x 2.5 x 2

but when I'm looking at the ceramic bearings to purchase, i look at the bearings itemized in the kit and the dimensions are different? The $50 ceramic Dnano kits say the fronts are 4 x 1.2 x 1.5 which is the same as your info

However, the ceramic kit states the rear dimensions are 6 x 2.5 x 3?

I'll just purchase and hope that extra 1mm doesn't make a difference for the rear Inner Diameter (hopefully it doesn't have too much play with the diff shaft).

I'll keep you guys updated...but i don't really know how to test it with empirical data? Any suggestions? I can go by feeling but that isn't accurate...testing lap times are possible too but i'm not consistent enough and my track is too small (best lap time with the track upstairs is 2.87 seconds...lol).

I'm going to purchase and keep you guys updated if I remember to :P

-Ray

[MrNanoTrax]

Originally Posted by SiRay6

I'll just purchase and hope that extra 1mm doesn't make a difference for the rear Inner Diameter (hopefully it doesn't have too much play with the diff shaft).

I'm going to purchase and keep you guys updated if I remember to :P

-Ray

dnano bearings sizes are very specific... if the rear bearings are too wide they'll 'stick out' and rub with the wheel hub. i'm guess you're just into testing and aren't necessarily doing this for performance? it was seem strange to spend 50USD when the XP-Ceramic bearings FULL SET is ~30USD

[Tsal]

Just like Qon says bearing sizes are very specific. I'm sure you can find different brands like XP or others to test that are cheaper in price. Good luck keep us posted.

[SiRay6]

Well, I purchased and I'll let you guys know when I get them in...I was really confused since the size you (Tsal) mentioned and the ceramic set Boca listed were different dimensions for the rear but I ordered anyways :P The dimension of the rear that was different was the ID (2mm vs. 3mm) so it'll fit fine except there may be a little free play where the diff shaft meets the bearings?

Well, I was just hasty since you (Tsal) posted this and I'm sure XP is something Qon can test (if he hasn't already) and comment on the difference between XP and Kyosho. Qon, is the XP ceramic vs. Kyosho bearings night and day difference?

Yea, I wasn't really interested in getting new bearings since my kyohso are good enough...but I'm curious if a bearing company that specializes in bearings are any better (only one way to find out). Kyosho and XP I'm assuming don't manufacture/specialize in bearings solely, so my curiosity is tempting me to try these out to see if a company specializing in bearings are any better.

So i ordered the econo 10 pack for front and rear, a set of ceramic bearings for the Dnano, and 2 sets for my mini z. I'll keep you guys updated but i have no idea how to test (if you got suggestions, let me know) the bearings.

On a side note...i have (between my fiancee and I) 6 sets of PN racing mini z bearings and they are very inconsistent (some are good, some are not, some have a lot of slop, some don't). So maybe Boca bearings will be more consistent? If not I know the Reflex bearings are good and I'll try those next.

-Ray

[MrNanoTrax]

Originally Posted by SiRay6

Well, I was just hasty since you (Tsal) posted this and I'm sure XP is something Qon can test (if he hasn't already) and comment on the difference between XP and Kyosho. Qon, is the XP ceramic vs. Kyosho bearings night and day difference? -Ray

there's rarely a night & day difference between available optional parts (well... the kyosho/xp diff and atomic diff...but thats a long story). the car and its performance are a sum of its parts. if you have one car with all the shoddy option parts and you have the same car with all the best available, its quite likely you can see a performance difference but just ONE of the parts? no... probably not.

like i've mentioned, i have all the sample option parts from lightweight wheel shafts to racing wheels - 95% aftermarket optional parts on my mazda and no other car in our club is close to the performance of that thing. if kyosho's parts were more easily accessible and more affordable, i'd probably be partial to their stuff but exceptional aftermarket options pulled me away from 'brand loyalty'.

[Tsal]

[quote=MrNanoTrax;209612] no other car in our club is close to the performance of that thing.QUOTE]

Because your probably a better driver. Thats a whole different topic. lol...

[MrNanoTrax]

hahahahahah... interesting point

[SiRay6]

Well, i got the bearings in and from just looking at them, everything seems right...except the rear ceramic bearings; the inner diameter of the ceramic rears are too big.

I emailed and they will send me the correct sized rear ceramic bearings. I guess they gather their specs from what customers submit to them so this is the first time someone has mentioned the rear inner diameter is too large (3mm when it should be 2mm).

When i find time, i'll play with the different sets and see if there are any difference between, kyosho, boca economy, and boca ceramic.

Any suggestions as to how to test these side-by-side, let me know.

-Ray

[SiRay6]

Well, i didn't play with the dnano much but i have a conclusion regarding the 3 different bearings.

- Kyosho front bearings are opened so the balls are exposed (yes go ahead and giggle, it sounds funny).
- Boca economy front are like rear bearings and are completely enclosed.
- Boca Ceramic front bearings look identical to Kyosho where balls are exposed

My kyosho bearings are about 4 months old and i have cleaned them with electric parts cleaner recently.

I installed the Boca economy bearings in one of the front hubs to compare with Kyosho (Boca-right hub and Kyosho- left hub). The Kyosho spins a lot faster, smoother, and much longer than the boca economy bearings. I just used my finger to spin it and it was a really significant difference. The Kyosho (cleaned) apparently kicks the Boca economy bearing's ass. I would rather invest in the Kyosho ball bearings than the Boca economy bearings hands down without any doubt!

With the Boca economy bearings, out of curiousity i soaked them in electric parts cleaner just to see if they would match the Kyosho and although the cleaning did improve the Boca bearing's speed and smoothness, it still had more resistance than the Kyosho so could not spin nearly as long as the Kyosho.

--Boca Ceramic: I installed these in place of the economy bearings to see how they compare to Kyosho. WOW! There was a very noticeable difference between the Boca Ceramic and Kyosho. The Ceramic bearings spun much faster, smoother, and significantly longer! I was really surprised! I immediately changed out all the fronts to ceramic and the ball diff bearing. The other bearing was the wrong size so i didn't change it.

So with majority Boca Ceramic in the Dnano and 1 Kyosho bearing in the rear, i tested it on my small rcp track upstairs (while watching tv hehe) and i can tell the car is much faster. It was like running a 200mah battery or even better? I didn't get a chance to test what it will be like with the 200mah battery but I'm sure it'll be even faster (too fast for my small track in fact!).

So, my conclusion is Kyosho ball bearings are a great buy at mid $20 range...even though the boca economy can be had for about the same price ($20 ish) but you can install on 2 dnanos...I'd still much rather get the Kyosho because it is significantly better than the boca economy! Why have more of something that isn't going to satisfy you?

Now, ceramics are really expensive for such tiny little things...but I liked them so much I'm not sure i want to ever put the Kyosho bearings in :P I'm actually wanting to purchase another set for my finacee's dnano. Or I'm actually interested in buying a set of ceramic bearings that Q'on sells and compare to Boca Ceramic

There were no hard facts or numbers (lap times, speed, acceleration etc..) in my tests but i can truly say, the difference between Boca Economy VS. Kyosho was night and day and Kyosho wins! The difference between Kyosho VS Boca Ceramic was night and day as well and the Boca Ceramic wins!

Tsal - Great find and thanks for sharing...but i think the Kyosho bearings are the bang for the buck...if money is no object, ceramics are better and worth it

-Ray

[MrNanoTrax]

thanks for the report and confirmation, Ray.... i think your 'spin' test was simple and effective - i never thought of that, but its a perfect test. the front bearings in the X-Power set are steel, but they are sealed. the rear are ceramic but the one installed inside the diff housing (not the one on the shaft) has exposed balls (i think cuz its enclosed and has little exposure to dust). all 4 of my dNano run this set