paper clutch LSD!!
 

EDIT: I recommend trying my type 2 design. much more consistant lock and no power loss;) all you need to do is place 1/4 inch punches flat against the center plate between the 3 little pinion gears. no removal of parts cept maybe for the little differential pin. just stick them in. paper, plastic or metal :)


tired of diffing out with that old open differential?;)

ok well earlier i was mad cuz i kept diffing out so i took apart my differential n tried to find a way to make it an lsd. i acctually considered gluing the gears in place. [locked differential] well long story short!:D

i saw my hole puncher on the corner of the desk...

ok here we go!

1. take apart that open diff

2. take out the pinion gears [small center gears]

3. flip side gears [gears on the sides] so the toothed side is facing outwards towards the axle.

4. between the flipped side gear and the center gear holder thingy [ring gear?] put a little stack of hole punched paper [the lil holes that go everywhere when you hole punch :D ] find the number of "plates" you like. [more you add the more "locked" ur differential is.]

5.repeat to other side

6. sandwich dhat thing together and start driving :D
[i dont think youll need that lil metal pin anymore so you can put it to the side with the pinion gears]

its almost like a real clutch type lsd! on my dusty garage floor i can drift and slide pretty nicely :p

oh yeah first post! just thought i'd share:)

hmm i was just thinking...

i could try different types of paper for different diff. characteristics..

sounds awsome. but how will the paper allow the diff to slip occasionally, also a pic would aid in the concept

Isn't it awfully hard to get a stack of tiny pieces of paper (chads, actually) to stay in place when you're installing them?

sorry i dont have a digi. ill see if i can borrow my friend's.

well when you turn, the lil papers act like clutches. it'll slip easier or harder depending on how many you have in there. the idea is like a real clutch type lsd. you could try looking around the net and look at some kaaz cuzco diffs. the "clutches" lock against each other while still being able to slip a bit when you turn. if you put in enuff, like around 6 or 7 each side itll act like a locked diff. around 3 or 4 and they're slipping alot especially when you punch the throttle going straight. i only acctually thought of the idea and tried it last night. im thinking 5 chads would be enough for a reasonable lock.:D and yes it is kinda tricky to get them to stay. these little things stick to ur fingers sometimes. if you stack them like a sandwich and then hold it together while you're screwing the whole thing back together it isnt that hard.

6 - 7 locked

4 - 5 slip

i started out with 4 each side. i noticed also after a night of driving the "discs" wear down maybe just the paper becoming more compressed against eachother. so i added some and moved to 6. maybe it was too much. im gonna try 5 or maybe it just has to "wear in" the paper im using is the printer kind.

technically speaking....
 

your exzactlly right with the theory/concept you have. But don't you want to try some cardboard mixed with posterboard I figured out the exzact same thing you did awhile ago and I tried different types of combos. You ever played GT3 they have 4 diff slips a oneway, 1.5way, and twoway then the custom slipunit. take posterboard and mix it with cardboard and it's pretty much like a oneway lock so to say. now take poster board and a few punchouts of paper and it's like a 1.5wayslip or you can make a two way slip type by taking two pieces of poster board. Make shure the slick side is noted where it is and face two posterboard shads together and with the shiny sides facing each other you have a certain type of surface tension this surface tension if modifiable with the white grease lube. Also use some testors paint thinner or something not that abbrasive and clean you diff first and use percision when applying the grease. Discard or store the pins that connect the two diff shafts together in a safeplace. Now you have a posterboard slip diff (PSD) and the best thing about it is that it doesn't compact a much as I found with the paper shads but the paper shads kind of put that .005 non special touch to it. Cusco slipdiffs are awsome and that Sakura is to.

Good material idea's guys.
I am using the instructions from the xmods to cut circles out that are the same size as the the 2 flat gears and put them between the spider gears and the flat gears. You have to oil the paper to give it a smooth and consistent slip. I'm using machine oil but any oil should do. I tried cling wrap and zip lock baggy plastic but they would just clog up the works and cause a full lock and were a bitch to clean out.
I'll try the hole punch idea tonight, thanks

if you flip the spider gears around so that they point in the other direction, it wouldln't mesh right wiht the ring gears because they're bevel gears

i took out the pinion gears and i just flipped the side gears so i could use the flat back side to press against the chads.

hmmm well i was tinkering with my differential again today and i had my auto mechanics book open:D to make a true lsd i would need to put the whole differential back together again how it was. to make it an lsd i would just put paper discs between the side gears and the differential casing so they would fit around the axles. this would obviously take more time then the hole punch idea because you would have to cut the little ring discs urself but it would be more like a real lsd. the discs would slip against eachother and the diff. casing. im going to try making my own discs and see if this works.

kaaz lsd

http://www.kaazusa.com/images/kaazlsd.jpg

That's mighty complicated. What's turning the final ring gear?

hey you guys I have further info for materials that I have been testing with.

Peanut butter plasic tubs the white plastic types have lots of flat surface for many lsd's it's the same type of plastic that is used with some 20. oz. coke tops and the like.

Plastic as I have found is very interesting you can make a locked plate disc connected to the shaft inside the spoke hub(discarding the bevel gear thingys). that rubs off on a center plate (center plate measured and huned at *__* thickness) made out of anything plastic posterboard papper etc. and then the same thing is vise versa on the other side. it's identical on eash side. A stronger (less slip) diff in front is better along with a weaker diff in the back. That is to say with awd kits of course. now just how to adapt this to a Tamiya dual gear box.

Sinistar

keep it drifting!!!

ohh, i get what you're saying now, i was thinking that you reverse the three little gears, not the bigger gears that hook up to the drive shafts

the final pinion is and the final pinion is turned by the driveshaft. the final ring gear is acctually the whole differential casing. so the whole casing is spinning. its like this in the xmods cept the teeth are on the side of the diff.

sinistar these are some great material ideas. have you ever tried metal washers? i found some that had the right diameter its just that theyre not thin enuff to work in the diff.

hey that diff pic is awesome. thanks I'm printing it now. Metal washers hum I could file the thickness down depending on what thickness they are. TZero+everyone I have been developing the slip diff types with only using the outside spoke hub, and the back outside hub. In eliminating the inside layer piece that regularly supports the 3 spider spokes you can start to see just how much space there is and just what type of plates/layers you can start to stack together. The whole softer flexable plastic thing doesnt really cut that well. So I'm looking for other materials but metal washers would be one material to be used in my next design since they are in fact used in the suggested back diff in the AWD kit. hey do any of you have ideas for drift tires.

Sinistar

i just figured a new design for the paper idea. i found a 1/4 inch hole puncher and the punches fit right between the lil gears. so the little punches fit against the center plate and push the side gears to the outsides of the diff. works much better then the inverted plate idea. all you need to do is insert these lil thingies while ur putting the diff back together. it is kinda tricky. yeah and the only part of the diff you dont use is the little metal pin.

nice job, i cut out 4 peices of paper that are the same size/shape as the big gears, and put the paper disks between each gear (so the layout is paper, big gear, paper, spider gears, paper, big gear, paper) i also added some vaseline, and even though my car isnt runnin (waiting on parts) the gear feels stuff but will slip when forced, and i havent noticed any wear yet ..

by far the best option i've found is packing it with grease. The hole punches are not very smooth and didn't have even slippage. Before this idea I was cutting circles out of paper(lol, the hard way) to make lsd's and they never felt right.

I went to the bike shop and he gave me some thick white grease that I packed into the differntial tightly. This works beautifully for drag and turning. These cars are very light so the resistance in the diff needs to be low and this works perfectly.

grease sounds like a great idea. sounds kinda messy tho. not really a clutch type but if it works, nice! what kind of grease was it? do you think gel or another substance similar would work? i thought of this b4 but i never really thought it would work. i should give it a try.

back to the clutch idea. i soak the paper in baby oil. gives it a little more consistency. the paper really has 2 roles. it just pushes the side plates against the sides of the diff and provides a surface for the plate to slide against. in real cars clutch lsd's bang cluck and grind in low speed turns. not too pretty sounding. in xmods it sounds the same way. except its the sound of paper sliding against plastic when i wear in my diff.:p right now i am running the 2nd type with 4 punches on each side. you can also adjust the diff by putting in more or less punches or just by loosening or tightening the screws . anyways. here are some pics(diagrams) of the lsd's i made. and just by inserting hole punches.;)

Not sure what kind of grease it was but it was in a tub and was white. The guy is a fellow car guy so I told him that I wanted to pack the diff to make an lsd and he put some in a plastic baggy and gave it to me. It wasn't gel but it was maybe lithium grease. An auto parts store should also be able to give a good recommendation for a product.

The only bad is that it's not adjustable like a paper one but it will not degrade over time.

EDITE: The clutch type you made should slip when power is going to the rear wheels causing your power to go no where and just make noise. If it is tight enough to make all the power reach the rear wheels then it would be so tight it wouldn't slip at all around corners. I think that's how it would work but let me know what experience told you.

The grease type is very loose and I thouhgt it wouldn't provide enough resistance but it turned out to be perfect.

haha i jacked some microscope coverslips from science class today. punched them and stuck them in my diff. you only need 2 per side. they work pretty fine so far. i have my diffs set up so i can easily tune them for drift or grip. just remove the left right wheel and slightly turn the screws turning the diff so you can get to each screw. my rear tires are toast now and ive already completely broken a c-cup. good thing i have replacement drivetrain parts.:D

with the 1st type it was like that. etheir power was wasted slipping the diff or the diff was too tight causing it to be locked. i started getting frustrated but the locked diff let me slide around without diffing so i was happy so far. and then i went to office depot and found a nice single hole punch (1/4th inch) i found that the punches moved around too much for the 1st one. then i compared the size to the space between the 3 center gears. perfect fit! so i put together a 2nd type. the 2nd type is much more effective as you can go with lower amounts of lock and not waste power. lower amounts of lock also make it act less erratic because of the roughness of the paper. i found plastic not to be a good material because after a while the plastic binds against each other and ends up acting like paper. my friend gave me some washers from a 4wd tamiya and they are the exact size as the smaller punches. i stuck 1 on each side and put lubricant in the diff. i tightened the diff to a reasonable lock and it works much better then the paper or plastic. so far im happy with it. much more consistant drifts and more percise gripping:D

oh yeah the little ring on the gear side on the side gears are wearing out. theyre ending up flat but they add more surface area. i think after a while i might need a new diff. to mess with. yeah and on another note these diffs act more like 2.0 way diffs.

If you are ever desperate for an extra diff i might be able to help you out. I've got 3 diffs and one running car

thanks for the offer but i just got 2 more extra diffs from friends that were so eager to get rid of their stock parts. :)

i was so bored today i took 1 of them and stuffed toothpaste in it. i didnt have any grease lying around anywhere so i thot toothpaste would be worth a try. it works. not enuff lock for my liking but it was nice and smooth. after awhile of running it toothpaste started oozing out of the diff....

well at least it smells minty clean now :D