Gyro Test

[kg6ein]

ok lets start with some back ground, I have been into RC for over 20 years. from planes to 1/10 scale electric and nitro to helicopters, but never micros or minis. I picked up my first mini yesterday 5/11/09 and promptly put 3 batteries through it. That thing is awesome. OK so i am a gadget geek and went back to the HTUSA today and picked up some new gears springs and a Gyro.

After installing the Gyro I noticed right away that it was working, if you pick up that car and shake it just a little the front wheels will turn back and forth, The stock setting of the Gyro works very well; there is still plenty of power however my starts seemed quicker due to less tire spin on take-off, my track times (on home built track nothing fancy) were faster than last night. after the first battery pack i recharged and put it back on the track and there was trouble, i could not steer the car, it would lurch forward and stop, then go in reverse. Quickly i removed the top looked at all my wires all looked good, put it on the track with out the top and all worked fine, put the top on and same issue.... Yes the wires from the Gyro can not touch the body or strange things will happen. This is covered in the install instructions however I did not pay attention to that part as closely as i should have.

Over all not having a racing back ground with mini/micros yet i think the Gyro is a keeper, and once i have an ICS programmer I am sure it will be a true performer. In its stock program it is a noticeable difference and is well worth the money.

Side note, I have not timed the battery life with and with out the Gyro but it does seem to run out a little faster with the Gyro installed, but this is just an observation and have not got into the timing yet.

Hope this review helps any one that is sitting on the fence wondering if they should get one or not.

[kg6ein]

Sorry post does not talk about what car, I purchased the DNano Subaru 2006 WRX.

SUBARU Rocks!

[-J-]

Here's how I feel about the gyro.

It's interesting technology. No doubt about that in my mind. I've been into micro r/c helis for about a year now, and the gyro really makes or breaks a heli.

Gyro applications on a car, I just don't see this being as useful as on a heli. I run my dNaNo on carpet, pretty high grip surface, the track is fairly slow, tight and technical. On the track, the gyro is slower. It definitely settles the car down and makes driving 'smooth' easier, but there's no doubt in my mind that's it's slower. It doesn't let you push the car through corners as hard as you could without the gyro. You can only get about 85% of potential performance out of the dNaNo with the gyro installed. Now, on a more slippery surface, or a faster track using the x-speed, I could see it being more useful, but in my opinion, still not worth the money. It's helps new drivers drive faster quicker, but not faster in the end.

[Hobbytownsean]

Sorry post does not talk about what car, I purchased the DNano Subaru 2006 WRX.

SUBARU Rocks!

Thanks for posting your results.

[arch2b]

so essentially, it does what i expect kyosho wanted. it takes the average joe and makes the car easier for them to drive right away at a track vs. putting the time in to learn the finesse or track racing. from thier viewpoint, it's perfect for what it does. it gets newbies in the door and driving cars. for seasoned racers, you might want/need the experience of pushing the car to the edge.

thats how i see it anyway. i don't plan on buying the gyro :) not that i don't think it's worth it or that it works well enough, i just don't need the added crutch masking my racing skill defects.

[fovea3d]

He he, I understand that everyone will have his own opinion about the gyro and I respect that, but here is mine: I love it!
I am not exactly a new driver so I would not need a gyro to be competitive, but we race on carpet and it is where this gyro gives all its potential.
Just watch this video (http://alain.galluser.free.fr/Z/videos/081003F3FDnano.wmv), that was last year when some in our club just got their dnano's. Everything, tires, H-bars, etc was stock except a few X-speed (the two yellow murcielagos). With the gyro I could lead while the others had hard time with the lack of grip. Sure this was not a fair race, but it was some kind of comparison test.
Watch at 1:27 Tytoo, who normally is a better driver than me when we race mini-z losing control of his Enzo while giving throttle.
For me the dnano with the gyro is a superior machine, you can really push it to the limits... Later that night it could even keep up with some mini-z on that same track (well except Tytoo's MZ :))
I don't think newbies would do any better with the gyro onboard. They should first learn controlling trajectories and throttle because even with the gyro it is still possible to make the rear spin out.

[arch2b]

I don't think newbies would do any better with the gyro onboard. They should first learn controlling trajectories and throttle because even with the gyro it is still possible to make the rear spin out.

given that the tracks in kyosho stores in japan are carpet and these are marketed to people directly as buy and race for stats online vs. competitve racing series i have to disagree. much like your track, the gyro will help the newbie who plops down the money to buy this, walk right over to the carpet track and put some laps down and drive with less loss of control. i'm not suggesting it will make them perfect but it gives them a much better shot at getting around the track than without it. i'm willing to argue a majority of buyers will never race these competitively thus buy the faster motors, hop up parts just to have fun and will be buying the gyro to help make it fun vs. taking the time to learn proper driving techiques and slowly adding speed to their car. this has always been the case with mini-z's and i see no reason why it would not be the case with the dnano. most buy these for sheer fun and enjoy buying the cool stuff for them, looking to make it easier for them.

just an opinion of course, not fact. :)

[fovea3d]

Well your opinion is certainly valid and I agree, Arch, but on the other hand I think a gyro may also be profitable to the more experienced users.
Like all MZ fans I always tried to tune my cars to their best, and I would certainly do the same with the dnanos, what I like with the gyro is that it will "smooth" an already touchy car by nature (due to its small scale), erasing the imperfections of the track surface and make it feel like it was a bigger scale, thus pushing it to a higher level of performance in addition to an already correct setup and good driving skills. I agree this to be a kind of cheat or artificial technique to make it perform even better, but eh, its working, its there on the open market and some of your competitors may have one under his shell :)
I have a gyro on my Murcie and it is my only car using one.
It all depends on the conditions if I may use a gyro or not. On carpet I definately will. But in fact my favorite place to run these cars is on a 10'' wide lane track (painted wood) with the stock motor, stock tires, and no gyro :)
Also, I doubt that the gyro would give any advantage on RCP and other foam type surfaces. It is basically and anti-skid device...

[arch2b]

...but on the other hand I think a gyro may also be profitable to the more experienced users.
i don't doubt that at all. :)

...what I like with the gyro is that it will "smooth" an already touchy car by nature (due to its small scale), erasing the imperfections of the track surface and make it feel like it was a bigger scale, thus pushing it to a higher level of performance in addition to an already correct setup and good driving skills.
exactly my point in why kyosho certainly made these and push them given they are sold at stores with the types of tracks where it works best. they have created a market where the gryo is easily sold and recommended for those ready to race out of the box which is a much larger percentage of the buyers than people like you and me. :)

I agree this to be a kind of cheat or artificial technique to make it perform even better...
i don't think it's a cheat per sae, it's just one tool in a driver arsenal. it's always been my opinion that drivers should focus on the fine points of navigating a track and throttle control prior to going all out with speed and hop ups. i would not think less of anyone using one, to be clear. for myself, i would only be cheating myself in learning the basics before moving on to bigger and better things. i'm the type that needs that basic level of practice with a car before jumping into the works. i have a box stock mini-z at my home track just for this type of practice driving. choosing the right lines and doing it consistently is far more important that what you have inside your car :) one could argue however that the gyro enables this to be learned quicker, to play devils advocate.

Also, I doubt that the gyro would give any advantage on RCP and other foam type surfaces. It is basically and anti-skid device...
yet another reason why i won't be buying one. i have access to rcp tracks only. the closest dnano track will be 3 hours away (each direction). i don't have the same learning curve you do for track surfaces.

[arch2b]

anyone have experience with the gyro on an official dnano track?

[kg6ein]

Arch, not sure if i agree that it will let a newbie driver become a racer however I think that every driver could benefit from the gyro, however i do think that as you are a more experienced driver you will need the ICS to program the gyro more to your driving style. I think the gyro is much like the TCS is professional race cars in that they will not make you a great driver however they will help to control the power and add a little more drivability across many tracks. But with all things in the RC hobby its all about proper tuning and learning your equipment and your limits with it.

[arch2b]

i didn't say it would make the newbie a racer... it will however make them easier to drive, just as you've said.

...they will help to control the power and add a little more drivability across many tracks

[lornecherry]

I'd like to see some tests with the Gyro and the ICS tweaked. If it's 85% performance of the car without the Gyro, then tweaking the settings via the ICS and/or other hop-ups might get it to 100%, or even better. And with more speed (i.e. X-speed) the Gyro may help exponentially, especially with crappy drivers like me.

As with the Mini-Z, there will be a learning curve with all these add-ons and hop ups (some will prove to be good, some are no doubt garbage) And certainly, there there's a difference between running on foam or carpet with either foam or rubber tires.

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The Gyro's effectiveness is probably surface-dependent, meaning it will be more or less useful depending on the track's coefficient of friction. Finally, somebody, somewhere is modding one of these and setting up the car for drifting, at least I hope so. That was the first question my 14 year-old son asked ...do they drift? Like it or not, the serious club racer is only part of the market appeal for the dNano, and that is a good thing.

[Pierro]

Hello!

For my personnal point of view, as said before, gyro only makes the car more smooth and help to have consistancy lap after lap.

I have it and love it. On both my mini 96 at home or on the larger track at the club. One important thing with the Dnano, is the fact they're so small...
Even a little bump a mini-z would never "feel" can make this car chatter.
For me, the gyro helps preventing these kind of problem on RCP. Sure the RCP is a great surface, and with the right tires, it's easy to go fast with a consistant car and so, focus more and more on line.
But with the Dnano, if you want to get the most out of this car (on an "non-perfectly flat" ground), you will need the gyro.

I'm curious about testing a Dnano on a full flat carpet track. On this kind of support, I do believe the Gyro will not be as effective. On carpet,your car is constantly lightly drifting in the curve. At least if you try to push hard. So the gyro will only try to get the car "back on the track" leading to a smooth but slower turn. I do suppose the Dnano (and so, it's gyro) is set for RCP track as tires are developped to work on this surface.

[arch2b]

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i'm getting a bit confused here in the recommendation for the use of the gyro related to track surfaces. i understand there will always be some difference of opinion, but what i am reading is contradictory regarding carpet vs. rcp.

a couple of drove dnano's around on rcp tracks and there really wasn't any trouble whatsoever other than the random tile variation bumps. the large track was rather well used and not stored in a manner that keeps the tiles flat though. i had no issues on my mini-96 at home.
i do think the x-speed will greatly exaggerate any surface anomalies due to increased speed and as others have mentioned, this is where the use of the gyro would seem to excel. with the stock motor though, i found the car to be fine.

what exactly does the gyro control? does it override steering input to correct course only or does it also combine altering throttle response as well?

i'm sure i'm not the only one thinking this but when will this show up on mini-z's? i have no doubts that is where it's headed next.

[fovea3d]

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In my experience, the gyro will only be helpfull when lack of grip is a concern, being on carpet at moderate speed or RCP at very high speed. The best way to see the gyro action is to drive on wooden floor or tiles. There you will see the rear wheels loose grip and the car instantly correct its trajectory to return in line. I was amazed when I saw this for the first time, a quick correction jump, just like a slotcar returning to its course after the guide has reached its rotation limit in a curve, if you see what I mean.

In normal race with the gyro, what I feel when cornering at high speed is some massive understeering but as soon as I release the throttle the car will turn frankly into the curve, or even oversteer if the front tires are soft enough. I don't feel any sort of correction on the throttle, only understeering like if the car was saying, "OK slow down now so we can turn". Remember that when the gyro enters in action it means that your car was already out of the line, so the same situation without the gyro would equal to spinning out (or countersteer if you are fast enough). This gives a very confident driving but I don't think it would be something the beginner would apprehend easily. The beginner would either go straight to the barrier due to the understeer or to the inside barrier because he was suddenly to slow. The amount of correction of the gyro has to be controlled with the throttle while it affects the steering, very strange indeed :)
I think the gyro will only control the steering, I may be wrong, but I never felt any loss of response with the throttle, either when entering or getting out of a curve or doing donuts.
If the gyro was transposed to the Mini-Z it may probably require a separated racing class.

[arch2b]

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thanks for description on the gyro, very interesting. i'm hoping i get to see this in person soon. more and more dc club members are buying dnano's.

[jdob]

what exactly does the gyro control? does it override steering input to correct course only or does it also combine altering throttle response as well?

There are both steering & throttle adjustments available for the dNaNo Gyro by way of the I.C.S. USB Adapter...

[fovea3d]

Interesting. I don't have the adaptor so my settings are stock. If it does control the throttle it would be for a very short time or by a very small amount. Powersliding is still possible.
On the other hand, the action on the steering is obvious.

BTW don't know if any have seen this video (http://alain.galluser.free.fr/Z/videos/dnanogyro.wmv), this is the correction given to the steering depending of the overall orientation of the car at 1/4 the real time. At real time it is almost too fast to notice.

[kg6ein]

According to the documentation of the Gyro it assists with counter steer and reduces throttle to increase traction. However I have not noticed any real reduction in throttle but i have noticed the counter steer. I think that the track surface and the stock setting of the gyro are factors in this.

As soon as the track is set up at the Va Beach store we will be able to get more reliable conditions on a known track under and a controlled environment. I think that will give more conclusive data and show real results.

[-J-]

According to the documentation of the Gyro it assists with counter steer and reduces throttle to increase traction. However I have not noticed any real reduction in throttle but i have noticed the counter steer. I think that the track surface and the stock setting of the gyro are factors in this.

As soon as the track is set up at the Va Beach store we will be able to get more reliable conditions on a known track under and a controlled environment. I think that will give more conclusive data and show real results.

The steering and throttle gain can all be adjusted via the ICS cable. If it doesn't reduce the throttle enough for your liking, you can get the cable an adjust it.

Testing the gyro on the HTUSA track will definitely provide more concrete results. Everyone who has a gyro seems to have tested it on a different surface. lol

[jdob]

The steering and throttle gain can all be adjusted via the ICS cable. If it doesn't reduce the throttle enough for your liking, you can get the cable an adjust it.

On the dNaNo ASF Manager the Steering and Throttle Gains for the Gyro are shown as a numeric value ranging from 1 to 255. The defualt setting is shown as 128...so the default setting is right in the middle of the adjustment range...